Conversion of PIO card to OCI card is not mandatory

[imforumuser]

My understanding is that as per the present circular of the Government of India, conversion of PIO card to OCI card is not mandatory but is encouraged. One can travel on their existing PIO cards and applying for OCI cards in lieu of PIO cards is optional.

There are many people who are not aware of the optional nature, and are led to believe that PIO cards must be converted to OCI - this is not true per the circular. It is of course possible that at some point in future PIO will be discontinued. If this happens then an application can be made for OCI at that time.

Converting to OCI before March 2016 has one benefit that it allows applicants to save on the fees. Current PIO holders who use the "OCI in Lieu of PIO" before March 2016 are exempt from the fees.

Has anyone seen any official notifications that is contradicting the fact that PIO to OCI conversion is optional?

[jnk]

Not sure about it's optional or not but Last date to convert PIO to OCI extended to 06/30/2016.

Please follow this thread,

http://www.immihelp.com/forum/showthread.php/200099-Last-date-to-convert-PIO-to-OCI-extended-to-30-06-2016

[proonindiandoc]

Not sure about it's optional or not but Last date to convert PIO to OCI extended to 06/30/2016.

Please follow this thread,
http://www.immihelp.com/forum/showth...-to-30-06-2016

it is legal updated announcement. but recommend to convert

[sunrag1]

it is legal updated announcement. but recommend to convert

http://mha1.nic.in/pdfs/InstDated240216OCI.pdf

As per this latest circular, it does not say CONVERT. It just say about register. As per initial circular, existing PIO cards are valid for life. Also per latest website instructions, it just say "register". So I think existing PIO cards needs to be registered (follow partial Part A of the process) only. Look and feel of PIO cards remain the same however it will be considered as OCI cards.

https://passport.gov.in/oci/capchaActionPIO

OCI-Registration (In Lieu of PIO-Card) is an online process. OCI Applicants who are having valid PIO-cards may apply from here. Only after complete successful registration, an applicant will be considered as an OCI-Card Applicant (In Lieu of PIO-Card)


This is my interpretation based on several circular and Modi's speech & his direction.

[proonindiandoc]

http://mha1.nic.in/pdfs/InstDated240216OCI.pdf

As per this latest circular, it does not say CONVERT. It just say about register. As per initial circular, existing PIO cards are valid for life. Also per latest website instructions, it just say "register". So I think existing PIO cards needs to be registered (follow partial Part A of the process) only. Look and feel of PIO cards remain the same however it will be considered as OCI cards.

https://passport.gov.in/oci/capchaActionPIO

OCI-Registration (In Lieu of PIO-Card) is an online process. OCI Applicants who are having valid PIO-cards may apply from here. Only after complete successful registration, an applicant will be considered as an OCI-Card Applicant (In Lieu of PIO-Card)


This is my interpretation based on several circular and Modi's speech & his direction.

don't guess, i will give the clear update soon and just follow mine

[imforumuser]

Conversion of PIO card to OCI card is not mandatory

My understanding is that the original intent of the deadline to convert PIO to OCI was to allow current PIO holders to save on paying OCI fees (since they had already paid fees when they applied for PIO). Secondly PIO cardholder with a valid PIO card were only supposed to provide Copy of the valid Passport and Copy of the PIO Card for conversion.

It is anyone's guess why Cox & Kings does not make it clear on their website that the conversion is optional.


CIRCULAR
This is to notify that submission of application for OCI card in lieu of PIO card is voluntary and optional. OCI card in lieu of PIO card can be applied at https://passport.gov.in/oci. All extant PIO cards will continue to be valid until further instructions on the matter are conveyed by MHA. 2. Endorsements stating that existing PIO cards are valid for life would be made at the first point with which the card holder comes into contact, be it an Indian Mission, an FRRO or an immigration check-point. These endorsements/ stamps would, however, not be mandatory * * * * *
Consulate General of India, San Francisco
22 May 2015
It has been brought to our attention that rumors are spreading among Indian Diaspora community members that PIO card holders are not able to travel to India with PIO CARD after June 18th, 2015. 2. As you are all aware that the Government of India has withdrawn the PIO Card scheme and replaced it with OCI scheme for all Indian origin US passport holders. As part of the exercise of bringing about an uniformity in the scheme, all PIO card holders were intimated to get their PIO card converted into OCI card at the earliest as per instructions issued by the Ministry of Home Affairs (MHA). As per these earlier instructions, initially for a period of 3 months, the submission of the application for OCI card in lieu of PIO card was voluntary. However, after the initial period of three months, the conversion of the cards was to be made mandatory. The persons were to apply for OCI card in lieu of PIO card only at https://passport.gov.in/oci. 3. Considering the concerns and issues related to this conversion from PIO card to OCI card, it has been decided that PIO cards already issued continue to be valid documents. Applying for OCI cards in lieu of PIO cards at the website indicated above will be optional for the applicant until further instructions. All concerned are hereby informed that there is no deadline for conversion from PIO card to OCI cards. However, we urge all PIO card holders to apply for change to OCI cards for uniformity sake. However, when passports are changed / renewed, applicants may apply for miscellaneous services to update their passport details in the OCI cards. 4. As conveyed earlier, endorsements stating that existing PIO cards are valid for life would be made at the first immigration point with which the card holder comes into contact, be it an Indian Mission, an FRRO or an immigration check-point. These endorsements/stamps would, however, not be mandatory.

PS: this is not a legal opinion

[sunrag1]

don't guess, i will give the clear update soon and just follow mine

Its not a guess. I am saying whats written in Circular, Modi's speech etc. Read original officially released documents (not CKGS docs).

[proonindiandoc]

Its not a guess. I am saying whats written in Circular, Modi's speech etc. Read original officially released documents (not CKGS docs).

okay falks, confirmed same submission as usual, conversion is always optional and ckgs also mentioned, as strongly recommended.

[privatepilot]

Petition

I wrote the below to the Indian external affairs ministry and the PM’s office. Here are the links/ addresses: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], and contact PM of India: http://pgportal.gov.in/pmocitizen/Grievancepmo.aspx

My message was simple and I encourage anyone who feels this way to write something similar:

I am a US citizen by birth who has a Person of Indian Origin (PIO) card. Is it mandatory to convert the PIO card to OCI after June 30th? Will the PIO card be nullified after this date if we do not convert it?

I ask as I am concerned with the current environment in the US where Indians are being attached/ government policies are very unpredictable. Having been born in the US and never been an Indian citizen, I am hesitant to get something which calls me an “overseas CITIZEN OF INDIA” and would rather prefer to be just a “Person of Indian Origin”. So hopefully you will reconsider the mandatory conversion of PIO to OCI.

[vnmore]

I wrote the below to the Indian external affairs ministry and the PM’s office. Here are the links/ addresses: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], and contact PM of India: http://pgportal.gov.in/pmocitizen/Grievancepmo.aspx

My message was simple and I encourage anyone who feels this way to write something similar:

I am a US citizen by birth who has a Person of Indian Origin (PIO) card. Is it mandatory to convert the PIO card to OCI after June 30th? Will the PIO card be nullified after this date if we do not convert it?

I ask as I am concerned with the current environment in the US where Indians are being attached/ government policies are very unpredictable. Having been born in the US and never been an Indian citizen, I am hesitant to get something which calls me an “overseas CITIZEN OF INDIA” and would rather prefer to be just a “Person of Indian Origin”. So hopefully you will reconsider the mandatory conversion of PIO to OCI.

"Here is the latest popup on the site 'https://www.in.ckgs.us/oci/' as 'With effect from October 2018, International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) will accept only machine readable travel documents and hence the existing PIO cards will become invalid. Therefore it is advisable to obtain machine readable OCI cards in lieu of existing hand written PIO cards on gratis basis before 31st December 2017'. This means, even Indian gov allow to use PIO card, due to ICAO, no airport will not accept handwritten PIO. Hope this helps to take the final decision.

[proonindiandoc]

"Here is the latest popup on the site 'https://www.in.ckgs.us/oci/' as 'With effect from October 2018, International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) will accept only machine readable travel documents and hence the existing PIO cards will become invalid. Therefore it is advisable to obtain machine readable OCI cards in lieu of existing hand written PIO cards on gratis basis before 31st December 2017'. This means, even Indian gov allow to use PIO card, due to ICAO, no airport will not accept handwritten PIO. Hope this helps to take the final decision.

which means that some of the PIOs were issued by printed version should be accepted, but the older PIO cards which were issued by handwritten will not be accepted.

[pratikchhatbar]

which means that some of the PIOs were issued by printed version should be accepted, but the older PIO cards which were issued by handwritten will not be accepted.

What is the authority of ICAO in international travel? When I leave US, no one cares what visa I am carrying with me. It is up to the immigation officer in India whether they want to accept the hand written PIO cards, which still are valid for a given date. From what I have read a few years ago, is that since Modi unified PIO and OCI and also "on-arrival" visa, anyone with old PIO gets the stamp on their PIO cards by the immigration officer, effectively converting it into OCI card. So why bother converting PIO to OCI? We already have a machine readable document - a US passport!

[mukulsam]

which means that some of the PIOs were issued by printed version should be accepted, but the older PIO cards which were issued by handwritten will not be accepted.

I emailed Mr. Doshi [email protected] with following questions:

Question #1: My understanding is that PIO is still a valid document recognized by all agencies of Govt of India such as Bureau of Immigration, Ministry of External Affairs etc. Can you please confirm?

Question #2: Will my daughters PIO be recognized as Valid Travel Document by ICAO after Sep 2018 this year? It is not a handwritten PIO. Attached is the image of the PIO for your reference.

Question #3: Only hand-written PIOs are compulsory to be converted to OCI(which is machine readable) for any travel after Sep 2018. Is my understanding correct?

It got redirected to CKGS. You can assume their auto-response:

"Please be informed that with effect from October 2018, International Civil Aviation Organization will accept only machine readable travel documents. Hence the existing PIO cards will become invalid."

To which I replied:

Above sentence is missing a keyword; "hand-written". My understanding is only existing hand-written PIO cards will become invalid.
My daughters PIO is NOT hand-written and is already in machine readable format.
Kindly confirm in that scenario why and on what basis will it become invalid?

I am not expecting to hear anytime soon from them

Having said that there FAQs has this:
Q: My Son's PIO card is not handwritten but printed. Do I need to convert his current machine readable PIO Card to OCI Card?
A: The existing PIO cards are not machine readable.


So their (CKGS) argument is that all existing PIO (machine printer or hand-written) are NOT machine readable.

I can not counter argue beyond this point. Basically I am saying my daughters PIO is machine readable, and they say it is not.

[Liberty48]

Not really

What is the authority of ICAO in international travel? When I leave US, no one cares what visa I am carrying with me. It is up to the immigation officer in India whether they want to accept the hand written PIO cards, which still are valid for a given date. From what I have read a few years ago, is that since Modi unified PIO and OCI and also "on-arrival" visa, anyone with old PIO gets the stamp on their PIO cards by the immigration officer, effectively converting it into OCI card. So why bother converting PIO to OCI? We already have a machine readable document - a US passport!

At the airport check-in, they have to clear you by verifying a valid travel document required by the destination country. This is not the case for visa free travel countries, so don't get confused. For India, you need a travel document acceptable by India. That will be a visa, e-visa, PIO or OCI. The airport check-in includes the transit country. PIO will become invalid later this year when the mandatory scan-able document requirement comes into effect. So, get your OCI now if you will be travelling later this year. If you are going travel this month or next month, you may travel with PIO and should be ok if you return before the mandatory scanning comes into effect.

[mukulsam]

I emailed Mr. Doshi [email protected] with following questions:

Question #1: My understanding is that PIO is still a valid document recognized by all agencies of Govt of India such as Bureau of Immigration, Ministry of External Affairs etc. Can you please confirm?

Question #2: Will my daughters PIO be recognized as Valid Travel Document by ICAO after Sep 2018 this year? It is not a handwritten PIO. Attached is the image of the PIO for your reference.

Question #3: Only hand-written PIOs are compulsory to be converted to OCI(which is machine readable) for any travel after Sep 2018. Is my understanding correct?

It got redirected to CKGS. You can assume their auto-response:

"Please be informed that with effect from October 2018, International Civil Aviation Organization will accept only machine readable travel documents. Hence the existing PIO cards will become invalid."

To which I replied:

Above sentence is missing a keyword; "hand-written". My understanding is only existing hand-written PIO cards will become invalid.
My daughters PIO is NOT hand-written and is already in machine readable format.
Kindly confirm in that scenario why and on what basis will it become invalid?

I am not expecting to hear anytime soon from them

Having said that there FAQs has this:
Q: My Son's PIO card is not handwritten but printed. Do I need to convert his current machine readable PIO Card to OCI Card?
A: The existing PIO cards are not machine readable.


So their (CKGS) argument is that all existing PIO (machine printer or hand-written) are NOT machine readable.

I can not counter argue beyond this point. Basically I am saying my daughters PIO is machine readable, and they say it is not.

Got a reply from Vice Consul:

1) Yes it is valid document
2) Yes. It is valid.
3) Till now these are the instructions. It is better to convert it in order to avoid complications later.


so no need to convert PIO to OCI !!

- - - Updated - - -

At the airport check-in, they have to clear you by verifying a valid travel document required by the destination country. This is not the case for visa free travel countries, so don't get confused. For India, you need a travel document acceptable by India. That will be a visa, e-visa, PIO or OCI. The airport check-in includes the transit country. PIO will become invalid later this year when the mandatory scan-able document requirement comes into effect. So, get your OCI now if you will be travelling later this year. If you are going travel this month or next month, you may travel with PIO and should be ok if you return before the mandatory scanning comes into effect.

" PIO will become invalid later this year when the mandatory scan-able document requirement comes into effect" -> only and only if it is HAND-WRITTEN. Most of the recent issued PIOs are machine readable.